>This is the fee taken from an app's net receipts for listing it in the Windows Store. While an app's accumulated total net receipts are less than 25,000 USD, this fee is 30% of the app's net receipts. After an app accumulates net receipts that total 25,000 USD, this fee drops to 20% of all net receipts for that app from then on. The remainder is your app proceeds.
And? Who says valve is gonna put a free app on their shitty service? Even if they did, who says that they have to give microsoft money for games sold through steam, even if steam was downloaded through the store?
>>149906954 >Who says valve is gonna put a free app on their shitty service? If they don't want to go bankrupt, I guess they don't have the choice. OR they just go to the 0.5% of people who will switch for linux.
>windows enter the digital distribution competition for real this time >steam has to enter stockmarket to print money >Gabe Newell is not named CEO >stock holders force bullshit in steam You know this is what will happen.
>>149907361 >implying you even own a license >implying you own anything buying games from steam you are only receiver of service aka subscriber and valve can strip you from your subscription at any time they want.
>>149907337 No, he's worriegoingt windows is going to force Steam into an app store contract and cut into profits. He's also worried raising compter literacy and anti-M$ sentiment will make a linux platform more attractive, even without Steam
>mfw Steam is going to die >mfw Gaben is desperate trying to put his DRM on linux now, but Stallman is telling him to fuck off >mfw all these suckers on /v/ will lose all their games when Valve bankrupts
>Microshit late to the party as usual >forcing all software that can be ran in Win8 to be signed/certified by Microshit, effectively giving them the authority to decide what you can do with your own computer >not realizing this is even worse than Apple
They're not obligated to put Steam in the Store. People will continue to download Steam from steampowered.com just like they've done for 10 years. Is there something I'm missing? Are you telling me people in the future will be so lazy that they won't be able to do a simple google search for the shit they want?
Holy shit man, either I'm missing the joke or there's something I don't know.
>>149908000 >he's worriegoingt windows is going to force Steam into an app store contract and cut into profits It is totally false, they don't take a cut on transactions made inside the application. Same as the apple store, and I didn't hear Gabe throw a tantrum at Apple. Read the link in op as source.
>>149908241 >I don't understand. So fucking what? >more attractive for publishers >less steamworks games >eventual exclusivities >more convenient (fully integrated in windows) for casual users (ie steam crowd) Don't you see how it can hurt steam?
>>149908858 Oh, my mistake. I'm still not buying a single fucking thing on that Metro shit though simply because of how user-unfriendly it is. I don't imagine many people will be willing to put up with that. Certainly not people who play video games, where that service essentially turns your PC into a console.
>>149908954 Well. Apps are really small, lightweight programs to do simple tasks. This shit won't fly on PC, because it doesn't need standalone rss readers, youtube explolers, facebook posters and twitter viewers. It all works perfectly here natively. And people understand that.
>>149908817 Hey, you can't go around spreading bullshit, you know. I've negotiated with Valve, and got the cut down to 15% for my game. Sure, it's one of those huur indie gaems, but still. They don't indefinitely take 30% cut.
>>149909287 >Current Steam users are not going to abandon it because they have games and friends on there. Doesn't matter. What keeps a company going is growth, Microsoft monopolizing like this is cutting Steam's growth.
>>149909264 The people that put their game up for Steam negotiates a contract around 30% which has been mentioned multiple times interviews years ago. I'm way too lazy to find any citationf or you. I remember reading Valve took something lesser than the typical cut for indies.
This is the future for MS. If you want to put your game on their store, or their system you will have to pay them royalties. picture XBOB LIVE's terms. That's why a lot of indie devs are bitching at MSs' new approach, even Notch hates it.
Valve actually takes anywhere between 5% to about 45%. Depends on the size of the game, who is publishing it and how much it's expected to sell.
Apparently, it is actually indie developers who get the shitty deal. I know someone who got his game published on steam, Valve took almost half of the money he made on it. But a lot of big publishers have a lot more leeway on what they can expect to pay.
Although no one actually knows the exact percentage Valve take, because all this is kept private.
>>149907979 Yeah but still this is a bot response the last time I contacted them for a refund they responded with some weird instructions to reset my steam settings. The response after that was made by a human.
>>149909853 Oh no they won't, are you dense or something? Publishers know that Steam is what makes them the most money for PC games, they'll at least put their games on both the app store and Steam for a few years to get data. Then when Steam nets them more money, as always, they will either stop publishing to the MS store or continue on both.
Dude, seriously, if I see one of these retarded anti-steam threads that always end in ad hominem I'm going to have to bust out the bateman because I know that theres only one faggot who honestly believes steam is bad and the rest are just fucking trolls.
>>149910161 And how am I ridiculous, exactly? They're not going to jump ship immediately with no proof or metrics, especially since not many people will upgrade to Windows 8 until they get a new PC or all major new games start using DX12.
>>149909675 I really don't think that applies to Linux, we don't know how it will turn out. Remember that Mac's have a bad reputation amongst gamers and many users alike. Mac is only popular with the "hipster tech kiddies" that blindly praises a company with no technological knowledge. Linux on the other hand, is what most users use as an alternative to Windows. Not only that, but many people in server management are all using Linux today.
If Valve, Blizzard and many of the other indie developers truly want full income, they are going to try hard, real hard, people don't know about Linux, they have to promote it big time.
As for Linux itself, it needs to fucking decide what Distro will be best suited for the main user, in other words which one will be idiot proof. Ubuntu is already getting to this, I just hope that Valve also supports other distros, Mint etc.
There are already many games on Linux and the average Linux user pays more than the average Mac user, so that helps a lot. There is definitely a crowd for it. Windows 8 is a big problem, so will other MS OSs' will be, does anybody remembers when GFWL was available? They wanted PC Gamers to actually pay for the service, they are trying to make PC Gaming like Xbox LIVE, I truly hope that doesn't happen.
> Offline modes DOESNT WORK ;_( BootStrapperInhibitAll=enable ForceOfflineMode=enable > You don't own the GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMMEEEEEEE Neither do consoles, DRM isn't going to go away
> GAYBEN IS RESPONSIBLE FOR DRMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM Its the publishers decision whether or not to put steam authentication > Can you cite a source for that last one bub? Nope, its common sense. TW2 has no steam auth and you can run it straight from its directory without steam running.
>>149910308 I didn't say it would become the 1st digital platform day 1. But in 2 years, be sure microsoft has taken the monopoly. It is an unfair tactic, bad for the customers. But it is an efficient tactic (seducing publishers). I never said it was an actual good thing, you know. I mean, it won't mean cheaper games for us, just more profit fro them.
>>149909287 Um have you asked Stallman about this yourself? He says outright that steam is unethical. He recently when I asked him about the new EULA, he said it would be better to lose access to all of my games than to give up more of my freedoms.
He said there is a chance it could do some good if it gets users to switch to GNU/linux, but that steam itself is unethical.
>>149910636 That's cool, I do animated sprites. Thing is I practically grew up on GIMP though so I can shit out rendering in minutes using it, it's not the greatest art program but it's certainly capable enough. The new brush size slider in 2.8 drives me up the fucking wall though, had to downgrade to 2.6.12 until they fix it.
>>149910862 >He said there is a chance it could do some good if it gets users to switch to GNU/linux I'm pretty sure he said the exact opposite. He doesn't want Linux flooded with users that are openly accepting of freedom restricting software, and he's right.
>>149909750 >>149909823 It doesn't apply in the US either. Do you people not know what a Contract of Adhesion is? It isn't void for a number of reasons, why Valve makes no attempt to make sure that you are aware of this before you click accept. Another being that you have no ground to bargain with them. It is basically a take it or leave it deal, which they don't even make sure you are aware of.
These kinds of contracts haven't matter since the the 60s in the Stevens vs Fidelity and Causality CO. case.
Are you really this fucking blind in your hatred? Yeah, Valve is shit but now imagine Microsoft or EA wielding their power. It's the lesser evil and I will support it until GoG becomes a serious competitor.
>>149910072 VLC is published under the GNU general public license. Your legally free to use it as you wish, study it and modify it, distribute it, and distribute the changed versions of it. How is it immoral? Do you even GNU?
>>149911106 You aren't getting what I meant there. I know he is against freedom restricting software, he said steam on linux could encourage gnu/linux users to use freedom restricting software. That is bad.
What I meant though was that he said it could cause users to switch to GNU and free software. And get away from proprietary software. Being that if they switch to GNU and like it, they might try more and more free software. At least this is what I got from him when I emailed him about it.
>>149911506 What aspect is unprofessional? For commercial work the only problem I've had with it is the lack of proper colour management, I have to parse it through another tool if I need to work in Adobe RGB or LAB, but that's something they plan on fixing by next year.
I use to do value studies and colourise them, but I found that I was giving up too much control. I prefer working alla prima because I can structure my palette and have all my values in check from the start.
>>149911810 Will they have the choice? If publishers put their games exclusively on microsoft store, steamfags will have 2 choices : stick to steam and hope valve goes out of its lethargy, or go where the games are sold.
>>149911810 Nobody is saying all of Valve's customers will disappear overnight. The problem is a huge decrease in the amount of new customers, as well as publishers being swayed away from the platform in favor of a much larger and possibly more financially appealing one. Use your brain retard and stop viewing things on such a basic level.
>>149911978 Of course they will have a choice. It's a consumer driven industry. Publishers can go ahead and put their games on the service, just like with Origin, and watch it all drop down to catastrophic levels. In spite of all of EA's bleating they still ended up crawling back to steam.
>>149912194 >Of course they will have a choice. I am afraid you are wrong. Gamers are weak minded kids, they won't think twice to adopt that new store if it is the only way to play the new AAA releases.
>>149911962 Don't get me wrong, it's good for small stuff. It just doesn't have the functionality I need. It also takes forever to load up. If I want to do something small to post on 4chan, I open MSPaint. It's easy and works. I have Vista. If I want to do a better drawing for my friends or even posting in drawthreads, I use Paint Tool SAI. For my concept art shit I do professionally, I use Photoshop, since it has many features I constantly use, and the layout was easily adaptable and changeable. Photoshop is also very sturdy, in terms of program stability.
>>149911810 I'm willing to bet that more than half of Steam users aren't blind valvedrones, but people who are perfectly aware it's a glorified rental service and are only using it for convenience/deals/valve games. Will they completely stop using Steam? Unlikely. Will they stop buying there? Possible.
>"As much as I love Steam, I do somewhat worry about the PC as a gaming platform becoming owned by a single entity that takes 30 percent of all PC games sold," he told PC Gamer." Even if he is notch, I believe him more when he says that (becausee he probably negotiated) than a random guy in this thread pretending to be a developer.
>>149912334 >Microsoft proposes a better financial alternative than Valve, with the added bonus of providing direct access to the largest PC userbase in the world There is absolutely nothing stopping every publisher from switching to Microsoft's platform. Are you and every other steamfag going to stick with Valve and play no games? No, of course you aren't. Current statistics mean absolutely nothing.
>>149912956 >An app store will be more appealing to AAA publishers than the incredibly popular and well-loved Game Distribution platform that has 4million gamers online at any given time? Yes, because less margins, ie more money for publishers.
>>149913056 >Uh, what's stopping publishers from releasing games through both the app store and steam? What's stopping them to fully switch to that appstore? If they take more money from a game sold on microsoft store but knows most of their game will be sold on steam? How would you resolve that problem as a businessman?
>>149912860 Yeah pretty much, I'm of the opinion that I should have the skill to do my work without any tricks and that the quicker I get to the final effect the better. I mostly use layers to get most of the texture I want, but I'm specific about on placing it near the focal point. Not a fan of flooding the whole composition with extraneous detail when I can use that detail as effect to enhance the contrast of what's important.
>>149912892 >implying he isnt a developer just because you release a pre-alpha build and claim its a full game doesnt mean you arent a developer. notch is just a horrible developer and minecraft is practically what wouldnt even pass as alpha most places. even for an indie game, its a horrible piece of unfinished shit, but notch did develop most of it.
>>149913457 Then you are a retarded businessman. Me, I would just make sure most people buys it on the windows store. How? Probably by proposing it only on the microsoft store. Players will want the game anyway, no matter where it is sold.
>>149913080 Trying to sell your games in an APP store to morons who bought Windows 8 will result in far less sales than on a game-dedicated platform with a huge userbase. And, judging by the fact GFWL has been grounds for petitions and boycotts, it's not like developers are going to suddenly shift to a new version of it.
I don't understand how an App store is being touted as a Steam killer. The apple store sells more games than steam, they're little $1 games like Angry Birds. That's more the competitor Microsoft has in mind, not PC gaming.
>>149913056 The MS Store only allows Metro-style apps. Porting a game over to WinRT/Metro is far from trivial; it's just as hard as porting to OS X or Linux.
You can't install WinRT apps outside of the MS Store unless you have a developer license or are running Windows 8 Enterprise joined to a domain. So you'd need a classic Win32 version for Steam and a WinRT version for the MS Store.
>>149913445 >Why not go out and buy a hard copy for the same price?
Just so you know, you don't own the game with a physical copy either, only the media. But it's much harder to enforce if they ever decided to revoke your license, and your entire game collection isn't at the mercy of a single company.
>>149913574 wow... i'm with steam, and even i think your post is the most stupidest thing ever posted on this site. no fucking argument points whatsoever, nothing but impulsive writing and assumptions.
>>149913381 Why? Yeah modern Open GL 4.2 is better than Direct X 9 for games that is true. Valve showed L4D2 a game running on DX9 ran slightly better on Open GL 4 the newest version of OpenGL. You know DirectX 9 is from 2002 right, OpenGL 4 is from 2010 no surprise it runs games slightly better. Its 8 years newer. You know what also runs games better than directx9? directx 11 it is far more optimized.
And since microsoft owns direct X it isn't like they would have to pay extra money to use it. So why are we better off with OpenGL?
Valve is just going to switch their focus to Linux. If they do, I'm going to also switch to Linux because it's free and takes less resources. I also hear it's better for software development, which is what I plan to start my career in.
>>149913609 And how I work is where more matters. You use GIMP for your casual image editing, I use Photoshop for more advanced brush editing. SAI has it too, but it's not as stable and final as Photoshop is.
>>149913889 His statement was retarded, because any program can be put on that store. It is just "metro apps" (mobile apps) are only available on this store (when other programs are available both on on the store and on other places on the internet).
>>149913591 >sell 50% of the games you would have sold with increased profit on MS store >sell 75% on steam and 25% on MS store its likely its going to be something like that. if you remove it from steam and put it somewhere else, people arent going to look for it on the other store. theyll just buy a retail version, which gives you even less money. EA probably lost hundreds of thousands of dollars by not having BF3 and ME3 on steam. people didnt buy it on origin, and the majority of gamers are normalfags who didnt know origin was malware anyways.
>>149914079 You are clearly retarded. If you don't understand it has all the advantage for your business to sell the copies that bring you the most profit (because lesser margins from the store) and how making it exclusive to a store is good (I assume we are still talking about AAA games), because wherever you sell it, people will buy it. But whatever. I think you assume most people are loyal to steam.
Steam is ingeniously built. Even if you buy some games, fuck, even most games, from non-steam sources, you still have to open Steam for any game you bought from Steam. You'll see the front page every time, and any sales, every time, and you'll never entirely abandon it.
Steam will survive forever because of how brilliantly it was built.
People bitch about Sony & Nintendo a lot, i know i do.
But Microsoft is truly the worst piece of shit ever imagined at this moment. They gave the PC market the big finger with the shitty 360, a 8 old brick with no first party games, i mean what's the frikking point PAY FOR ONLINE I MEAN... WHAT THE FUCK?
If i buy a WII or a PS3, i have around 20 AAA exclusives to play. If i buy a 360, there is nothing but halo and gears of war (WHY ISN'T GEARS OF WAR ON PC MICROSHIT?)
And now Windows 8, a KIOSK/TABLET/PIECE OF SHIT windows made for 14 year old RETARDS.
Long life Steam, Sony, Nintendo.
Microshit, die in hell you fucking piece of garbage, your console is shit, your hardware is shit, and now your new windows is a fucking abortion
>>149914556 It does work like a repository for Metro-style apps. But other apps can only be listed, they're not sold through the store. There might be some exceptions for Microsoft stuff in the future.
I do expect developers to list them. Heck, they might even list them with a link to the Steam store page (which would be slightly hilarious).
Now, if Windows RT becomes popular and tablets get amazing hardware over the next few years, people might expect to play new games on their Windows RT tablets. Then companies will have to make Metro versions and we're completely fucked. Publishers like PopCap might decide that the Windows tablet market is more important than Steam too.
>>149914514 We already know linux is more resource efficient no one will deny that. I didn't, but linux being more resource effecient does not mean OpenGL is better than DirectX.
DirectX 9 is old its dated, it is poorly optimized when compared to DirectX10 which isn't as well optimized as DirectX11. Comparing OpenGL to DirectX 9 and then saying OpenGL is better than DirectX as a whole is just retarded. Which was my only point.
>>149915015 If linux and opengl are THAT good, why didn't they make a client before now when they are threatened by microsoft? Why didn't they use awesome opengl to make l4d2 in the first place? It is funny how linux and opengl are awesome, yet nobody does game for it or use superior opengl. Funny, don't you think?
>>149915382 >If linux and opengl are THAT good, why didn't they make a client before now when they are threatened by microsoft? I'm not saying Valve did this not because they are threatened. I'm saying Opengl and Linux are in fact better than Windows. >It is funny how linux and opengl are awesome, yet nobody does game for it or use superior opengl. Funny, don't you think? It seems you don't know anything about computers.
>>149915758 Enlighten me, genius. Why isn't Call of Duty, or battlefield released on linux? If it is better, I am sure everybody will switch to have better perfs. inb4 lol COD kid, it is just an example of popular game.
>>149916106 But I thought open gl was free? I thought devs had to pay money to use direct x. Wouldn't it be cheaper actually? Plus it would be compatible on more platforms. Why then? Is there something microsoft does?
>>149916290 Oh, but I don't care, as I am not a dev (I will still read it because it sounds interesting, thx). But I am just curious on why everybody uses directX when there is nothing but advantages to go linux and opengl.
>>149915695 Nobody has liked the OPTIONAL metro UI. From the actual engineering side, from an administrator's point of view, it's a great upgrade over Windows 7. And guess who buys the most licenses for operating systems? Corporations. Home users are an afterthought.
>>149916412 But it costs money to develop a game on directX anyway. Are you telling making a game with directX doesn't cost money in development? Do devs work for free because it is directX? I don't get it.
>>149908241 People (especially casuals) stick with what they are used to most of the time, and most PC gamers are used to Steam, and have built fairly large libraries on Steam by now. They arent just going to jump ship just because.
>>149916618 >From the actual engineering side, from an administrator's point of view, it's a great upgrade over Windows 7. http://blogs.gartner.com/gunnar-berger/windows-8-part-3-as-seen-through-the-eyes-of-a-desktop-user/
>>149916503 It's in the link. See: Why does everyone use DirectX?
Everyone uses DirectX because API choice in game development is a positive feedback loop, and it was shifted in favor of DirectX in 2005.
It's a positive feedback loop because whenever one API becomes more popular, it keeps becoming more and more popular due to network effects. The most important network effects are as follows: the more popular API gets better support from graphics card vendors, and graphics programmers are more likely to already know how to use it.
API use was shifted in favor of DirectX by Microsoft's two-pronged DirectX campaign around the launch of XBox 360 and Windows Vista, including the spread of FUD (fear, uncertainty and doubt) about the future of OpenGL, and wild exaggeration of the merits of DirectX. Ever since then, the network effects have amplified this discrepency until OpenGL has almost disappeared entirely from mainstream PC gaming.
>>149917327 Yeah, but it implies the PSP version is compatible on DS (like you can play a game using opengl on windows). So what you says doesn't make sense because the logic would say to make the game for psp (as it will work on DS with few modifications).
>>149917510 You mean the one that appears every time you log on? You mean the one that requires a complete retraining of every individual user because they won't be able to find the new hot corners on the desktop? You mean the one admins can hardly manage?
>>149917701 What...? No, you need to rework a shitload of API calls for a DirectX game to work on OpenGL. And then test it and rework it. Multiple times over. Porting a game to Gl isn't just changing two function calls. It's reworking the way the entire game works the graphical API, and the shaders, and a shitload of other things.
>hear about usenet >find out my ISP provides limited usenet access >browse some groups >mfw newsgroup called alt.binaries.pictures.erotica.6yearolds.fucking Is that shit there to catch pedos or something?
>>149917510 It isn't optional though, it was in early builds of windows 8. You could replace it with the start menu, and people did and liked it. Then they removed that option, and everyone complained and they said too bad we are sticking with Metro.
>Gaben releases steam on linux >More support for linux is added until almost every game has linux support, and those that don't can be used in WINE or some other workaround >Steam allows users that purchased their games on the Windows platform to get the linux version for free, allowing for a massive exodus of people to the linux platfrom >The era of the Linux computer finally arrives
>>149918585 >More support for linux is added until almost every game has linux support Yeah, I am sure publishers will release a linux port for your ass and the other 0.5% people who will switch to linux. I am sure....
>>149918758 >windows 8 is looking to be a gigantic failure >popularity is the main driving factor behind what OS to by >games are probably number 2 >games are ported to linux >neckbeards and nerds switch to linux >linux suddenly more popular than mac >people get curious because something free is more popular than glorious apple software >mac hipsters find a new OS to hipst >suddenly linux is on 25% of PCs >linux gets more games >linux slowly rises to 50% When the old generation dies, Ubuntu is the most popular OS.
>>149919303 >popularity is the main driving factor behind what OS to by >games are probably number 2 It has, of course, nothing to do with most pc constructor selling their PC bundled with windows. You know, those PCs 99% of people buy.
I view Valve's move as nothing but harmful to the Linux community. Valve tries to monopolize the Linux gaming market which is ripe for picking and pushes their shitty bloated proprietary client on to you. While killing better alternatives like Desura.
Of course, Valve's size will certainly get more games released for Linux faster but is it really worth it?
The only thing good about Windows 8 is that it will serve as a wake up call for people as to why Steam is a flawed system.
You are using a store front, from which the party behind it takes a cut out of the sales and you must remain logged onto in order to play the games, ON A FUCKING PC. At least on consoles you don't have to stay logged on.
>>149909236 In both cases, you would be in posession of the game, not the owner. If you would buy your game from one of the alternative sources of games (GamersGate, GOG, GMG etc) you would be the owner. In the end, you're both morons.